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Proposed Board Voting System
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Zero (The Anon One)



Joined: 24 Apr 2002
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And I think this is a bad idea, actually.

Six or even EIGHT mods, if we add a new forum? That's a huge number. And too many, frankly. It's hard enough to get four mods to agree about anything right now.

In addition, as someone else put it, talk about stratification.

Lastly, to allievate fear of a dictatorship? If there's tryannical abuses of power, then you'll have proof. And if there's proof, PM Brooke.
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Caroljoy



Joined: 23 Oct 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 5:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zenphobia wrote:
I think we should have two mods for each forum so that any fears of one becoming a dictator can be expelled.

Not to mention, if there's two people for each forum, there will almost always be a moderator around.


Good idea, I agree.
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~psy~



Joined: 11 Dec 2002
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, I apologize for not having the time, nor really the inclination to read all the moderator threads flying around. I got clued into this from a post Zephie made on my livejournal. I'm not exactly sure what being an election commissioner entails, but whatever it is, I'm sure Mindless would be a much better choice.

Thanks for the nomination, though.

Having said that, I'd like to add my two cents - though if this stuff has already been hashed out, I apologize.

Since Brooke doesn't have time to do his admin duties then I don't see how electing someone trustworthy doing admin would be any different from Brooke doing admin. As long as that's the expectation, I'm cool with it. Can we just say admin, rather than moderator? It's not like our discussions need MODERATING do they? And admin would just have the job of deleting NSFW stuff, no?

If you're worried about whether we can trust someone to do only that, then we should have a tag team of two radically different personalities.

For example, Saggio and Xan MUST agree on what needs to be edited. That way the offensive things would have to be pretty damn extreme before they'd get deleted because we all know how notoriously difficult it for those guys to agree on anything. Or Zero and Dood, for example. One pair for political and one pair for general and rants should suffice, no? More than four people is really getting ridiculous. Besides, if you always have to check with someone before you delete, you won't delete all that much because it's too much bother.

Zero, I think not agreeing on much is probably a good thing. It means only the really uglies (like Efraim's penis) get... uh... axed. And I'm pretty sure Saggio and Xan could agree that they'd rather not see Efraim's penis at work, or anywhere else, for that matter.

However, if there is any intention of deleting "spam", or banning members, or requiring log-in, I'd have to say we're in danger of losing something we've always been proud of. Our ability to ignore crap. Crap threads usually die quickly. Or sometimes they can be inverted into something good. Whatever the case may be, I think that the notion of deleting "spam" sucks the big banana, not just because labelling what constitutes spam is awfully subjective, but because on occasion, our replies are hilarious and worthwhile, and reveal a real sense of community.

But most of all, I hate the idea because I really do believe in free speech.

So much so that (dare I say it), I think if people have the kind of jobs where they could get in that much trouble for a lewd picture, maybe they should just not bother logging into the forums at work. There is always the chance that something's only just been posted, before anyone has had a chance to get rid of it. I've always checked stuff at home. Is that such a huge sacrifice?

I mean, come on.. who, besides Efraim, has continued to flout the common-sense courtesy of adding a NSFW warning? All we really need is one Zero or one Brooke to clean up after Efraim, and the chances of getting in trouble at work are pretty damn minimal. Why are we getting all paranoid, all of a sudden?

And if we really got nit-picky about it, we'd have to tell Dood to stop using his sigs - so exactly how far do we want to take this, people? If Dood took down his sigs I think I would cry.

Ah well. Too little, too late perhaps. Seems this thing has already gained far too much momentum.

Do you really think that moderation will improve the boards? I think no amount of deletion will truly improve the boards. The only things that will improve the boards are interesting topics and interesting posts. Whether these beacons are surrounded by ten crappy topics or a hundred, I'm pretty confident that they'll be seized upon in times of famine (gotta love my mixed metaphors).

The other thing that might help is a story - a story that's still going. We came here to witness a story unfold. That we've lingered for so long after it's conclusion is a testament in itself. It's inevitable that BS won't attract many fresh new voices until the next leg of it's journey.

The boards will flourish, dwindle and flourish again. It's not something worth worrying about. Most of us are still around, lurking, waiting for an opportunity, or scheming to create our own.
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lazy_dum_guy
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 3:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

... Would it be weird if I nominated Brooke?

Anyways...
Zero (The Anon One) wrote:
Yeah, yeah, I know, I mentioned that to Sag last night. But look, if you guys want an election so bad, just go ahead and pick a couple people by (fairly) general consensus to serve for this one election, alright?

I was just joking around. But did you miss my sad face? Here it is again
)*:
I wasn't behind having moderators in the first place, let alone wanting to have elections for them. Not that I won't hope for the best, of course, but most of my feelings on the matter are pretty much in agreement with psy's.

And if we're wanting to change the label of moderator, why don't we just call them janitors, since that's pretty much what they're supposedly going to be. Plus it might take a few people's egos down a notch, which isn't such a bad thing (-;

Quote:
Six or even EIGHT mods, if we add a new forum?

We might be adding new forums now? What would those be? Dood and D-man's tech forum? If they get their forum, can I get my much requested ice cream forum? And can I be Supreme Janitor of said ice cream forum?

But more seriously, if we are to have moderators, I did have the idea that a new forum might be added that would be unmoderated. To allow for free speech and all. But then I thought, would anyone really care to post in that section? I mean, without any topic, it might just be redundant given the General forums. And it's unmoderated status might just lead some people to post as much porn as they can. But I don't know, any thoughts? I'm all for experimentation here.
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SusH'
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 3:36 am    Post subject: WARNING: attempt to be comedious ahead Reply with quote

I would like to nominate SDG for janitor of the ice cream forum. While I don't think he's ready for the position of Supreme Janitor yet, I don't see why we can't look at that later down the track.

I've always known the BS forums have been missing something. Now I know it is the ice cream forum - and the ice cream forum alone - that can complete us.

That is all.
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lazy_dum_guy
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 3:53 am    Post subject: Your attempt was pretty darn successful. Reply with quote

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SusH'
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 3:55 am    Post subject: Oh nose! Reply with quote

I got a sympathy laugh!

You're swell SDG! *thumbs up*
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Guppy



Joined: 20 Mar 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 5:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can we add propositions to the election Zero?

Like a Proposition Prohibiting the use of Guest Posting in the Specialized forums...

And with all the new proposals of a new forum should be a Proposition as well but I think this forum is missing a Tech Forum we should have one.

and all hail the Supreme Janitor...
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Mindless



Joined: 06 May 2002
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 7:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The one possible issue I have with this is that stuff is sent to the comissioners by private message. The PM inbox sizes are small and I've had mine fill up a couple of times, and I think theres a good chance this would happen in this case. My inbox is 88% full with 42 messages in it, which doesn't really bode well for the commissioners.

So I think we need to be a bit cleverer here. Email votes to each commisioner, and in that email, have 2 things in it: your vote and a link to your profile, which for the sake of this exercise will have a visible email address in it that will correspond to the address you sent your vote from. This is to stop multiple votes from different email addresses.
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Zero (The Anon One)



Joined: 24 Apr 2002
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 7:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We need a nomination cutoff time, kids. Hopefully today. How about 6pm PST? Debates can start anytime after that.
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Zero (The Anon One)



Joined: 24 Apr 2002
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also, in addition to my earlier points about double mods for every forum, all the forums already have two mods really, and General has three: Brooke is still out there, after all. If you want two so badly, count him as the extra man.
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Zephie



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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 10:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just in case people are only keeping track of this thread, I posted my own view on everything (much like Psy did since I pointed her here) here.

Whee.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, apparently I was in the wrong about calling mods admin, because mods can only edit/lock threads but they can't ban people.

So calling mods admin only makes things worse.

JANITORS UNITE!

But truly, I question the need for mods. And I will miss the days of the unmoderated forums. Not all change is good.

*wipes tar from eye*

I'll see you in the ice-cream and porn forums, sdg.
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Saggio l'uno



Joined: 22 Apr 2002
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 6:14 pm    Post subject: That brings me back. Reply with quote

Oi oi oi!
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Guppy



Joined: 20 Mar 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 5:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zero (The Anon One) wrote:
Also, in addition to my earlier points about double mods for every forum, all the forums already have two mods really, and General has three: Brooke is still out there, after all. If you want two so badly, count him as the extra man.


Mr. Z... I think its brookes attempt just to be a shadow for awhile till we get this running smoothly and taking responsibility for our own forum.. Yes he is still admin and will do certain tasks however it was clear that he doesnt have the time to be involved seriously in this.

I dunno who are people emailing anyway... I mean most of us are pre-nominees whoever the commissioners are... and I do not like the secret email ballots either... We should keep it a caucus discussion and have written votes on the forums rather than pm, email or poll.
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Zephie



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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 6:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Written votes on the forum would take away public anonimity which might create reluctance to vote at all, though. And I think it's been stated that polls aren't the most stable/reliable means of getting votes down, since they tend to be buggy sometimes. I think Mindy's idea of e-mailing votes where the address has to correspond to your profile is fair, since PM boxes do indeed tend to fill up real quick. If people don't wish their e-mail address to be known publically like that for too long, then either remove it after votes have been tallied, or even create a quick new hotmail/etc account for this reference purpose.

And I'm not sure who the second (since Eggy's already agreed on being one) commissioner is either. Psy has declined, suggesting Mindless, as B had earlier. Would you accept, Mindy, or would you rather have someone else picked from the people-not-interested-in-modship? In which case, I'd like to hear more noms.

On the subject of double mods for every forum... I think Storyline wouldn't need a second mod. It's very low-key in terms of spam or random blathering, and I very much doubt that there'll be many flame wars or the like that people will need Brooke to step in. General obviously needs to keep the double mods, since it's very high-key on all of that. Rants/Politics, I'm still divided on - a lot of controversy comes up there, so it might not be a bad thing to have more than one view on it. On the other hand, Z has a point that we shouldn't have toooo many mods running around all of a sudden. Tipping the scales a little too much. If we ask to add a new forum - since a bunch of people seem to agree that Tech should have a separate spot - then there'll already be at least one mod extra, making the total of 5. We need enough to keep the boards clean, but not too many - the more mods we add, the more difficult cooperation between them could become.

And I'm all for calling the mods plain ol' Janitors. Or as I said in my earlier post, Monkeybutts.

By the way, not like I'm the one in charge or anything, but there haven't been any new nominations for mods since yesterday. Can we all assume we're done there and move onto debates? If so, maybe Eggy - as our only official commish so far - could start a new thread with a list of the accepted nominees and thence the debates can begin?
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Mindless



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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll fine with being the other vote counter.
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Zephie



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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 6:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yay!

Okay, so with Eggy and Mindy as our official election commissioners to tally votes... and the nominations having been pretty much settled by now...

Let's get this moving on to the next stage, shall we? Debates! O_O
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Guppy



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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 5:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I still do not agree. Sorry there is no way of it being accurate enough-- and I think Storyline would be fine with two mods especially the two people agreeing on the fact who were nominated to do it. Storyline does get spam from the past about the spammers there, is that they attack already started threads and brooke deletes the whole threads on accident supposedly.
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Zephie



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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 5:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Which part of sending in votes by e-mail are you against - the fact that the votes will be anonymous, or that they won't be seen by the public for checking if they're counted fairly? Because the latter is done basically by having two election commissioners who will tally and compare separate from each other. And I do think we can trust Eggy and Mindy to do this fairly. Or is your complaint about something else, Gups? Just trying to clear this up...
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